A place for the discussion of all things not closely related to the sport and its competitive side. (Locked down several times a year during the major championships)
I think what will ultimately do in Armstrong is the last racing stage is the nice little trek up Mont Ventoux. Armstrong is used to the last racing stage being the final time trial. I'm not sure he can hang with the real climbers on that cliimb.
The UK's Mark Cavendish is an absolute beast. In today's flat sprint stage, he was so fast, that when he swung off the wheel of his lead-out man, the other sprinters couldn't even hold his wheel. Within the last 200 meters, he put 5-6 bike lengths on the sprinters behind him. I don't think I've ever seen such a dominant performance at this level, especially on the second day of the Tour when all the riders are still fresh. He is no doubt the Usain Bolt of road cycling.
Armstrong third overall now after being in a breakaway the other leaders were not in. He's ahead of Contador now. The team time trial is tomorrow and with Astana favored to win it he could be in Yellow after tomorrow. Then it'll become real interesting.
Lance Armstrong, greatest cyclist ever and sheep will be now FORMALLY slaugthered at the Tour de France.
HORRIBLE TRUTH about Lance Armstrong is the same HORRIBLE TRUTH as about YOU The greatest cyclist ever was not able to see that he will now be FORMALLY slaugthered, despite that even a child would understand it. (1)
Problem is, when you are a member of the BIG SECT, as YOU, Usain Bolt and Lance Armstrong are, it is no more possible to understand anything whatsoever.
End Times Irony: role of BIG PHARMA Syringes One of the goals of the Doping conspiracy, falsely accusing the champions of natural sports to have used the BIG PHARMA Syringes was to sell the BIG PHARMA poison, wether it is injected with a syringe or swallowed as pill.
The same BIG PHARMA now assigned the ultimate job: to use syringes to drastically reduce the time required so far by the process to TERMINATE YOU, shortly after Usain Bolt and Lance Armstrong are executed in public.
As a member of the BIG SECT, YOU will accept to roll up your sleeves (2) for the "revolutionary suicide".
The reduction of the illuminati global village to Jonestown, with only a minor difference in the execution of the mass suicide: syringes replace the cyanide pills used in Jonestown. (3)
I guess he did a poor job of trying to slow down the breakaway group.
I doubt that Armstrong or anyone else on Team Astana did any work. Contador, obviously wasn't paying attention to get caught out like that, but I'm sure that if there was anyone dangerous in the front group, Johnann Bruyneel would have sent some riders back to the chase pack to try and help bridge the gap. But remember, they were probably given strict orders to do as little work as possible ahead of tomorrow's team time trial when all nine guys will be expected to lay it all on the line. I'm looking forward to hearing the commentary tonight.
I guess he did a poor job of trying to slow down the breakaway group.
I doubt that Armstrong or anyone else on Team Astana did any work. Contador, obviously wasn't paying attention to get caught out like that, but I'm sure that if there was anyone dangerous in the front group, Johnann Bruyneel would have sent some riders back to the chase pack to try and help bridge the gap. But remember, they were probably given strict orders to do as little work as possible ahead of tomorrow's team time trial when all nine guys will be expected to lay it all on the line. I'm looking forward to hearing the commentary tonight.
Uhhhh?????Whadhesay? Is Armstrong in physical danger or is he going to ascend, or descend, in some sort of rapture? Is he going to bend a wheel or is Scotty going to beam him up?
jazzcyclist wrote:I doubt that Armstrong or anyone else on Team Astana did any work. Contador, obviously wasn't paying attention to get caught out like that, but I'm sure that if there was anyone dangerous in the front group, Johnann Bruyneel would have sent some riders back to the chase pack to try and help bridge the gap. But remember, they were probably given strict orders to do as little work as possible ahead of tomorrow's team time trial when all nine guys will be expected to lay it all on the line. I'm looking forward to hearing the commentary tonight.
Actually, the Astana guys did do some work:
velonews wrote: Armstrong sensed something was cooking and nosed toward the front. Astana teammates Haimar Zubeldia and Yaroslav Popovych also bridged out when Columbia dropped the hammer with about 30km to go ... Unable to bridge across at the key moment and with three teammates up the road, Contador was forced to sit back and wait ... The gap widened to 41 seconds, leaving Contador ... Armstrong didn’t pull through until it became obvious the gap was going to stick. With about 10km to go, Zubeldia and Popovych started taking pulls at the front to drive the group home.
Lance should be in Yellow after the Team Time Trial and then it's on to the Pyrenees with Contador, in front of rabid home fans, and forced to become a de facto domestique to the Yellow jersey (Lance)... this could get very intriguing.
richxx87 wrote:Actually, the Astana guys did do some work:
velonews wrote: Armstrong sensed something was cooking and nosed toward the front. Astana teammates Haimar Zubeldia and Yaroslav Popovych also bridged out when Columbia dropped the hammer with about 30km to go ... Unable to bridge across at the key moment and with three teammates up the road, Contador was forced to sit back and wait ... The gap widened to 41 seconds, leaving Contador ... Armstrong didn’t pull through until it became obvious the gap was going to stick. With about 10km to go, Zubeldia and Popovych started taking pulls at the front to drive the group home.
Lance should be in Yellow after the Team Time Trial and then it's on to the Pyrenees with Contador, in front of rabid home fans, and forced to become a de facto domestique to the Yellow jersey (Lance)... this could get very intriguing.
It sounds like Johann Bruyneel potentially has a mess on his hand. But remember, in 2002, when Victor Pena took the yellow jersey after the team trial, he was still forced to play domestique for Armstrong, despite having beat him in the prologue. In this case, Contador destroyed Armstrong in the prologue, and only finds himself behind Armstrong due to bad luck. I say Contador should still get the respect that his #21 jersey warrants until Armstrong can prove that he's stronger than him.
jazzcyclist wrote:[It sounds like Johann Bruyneel potentially has a mess on his hand. But remember, in 2002, when Victor Pena took the yellow jersey after the team trial, he was still forced to play domestique for Armstrong, despite having beat him in the prologue. In this case, Contador destroyed Armstrong in the prologue, and only finds himself behind Armstrong due to bad luck. I say Contador should still get the respect that his #21 jersey warrants until Armstrong can prove that he's stronger than him.
It wasn't bad luck. It was Contador not paying attention while Armstrong was. That's experience of a 7x tour winner who's been through it all. That counts for something in that kind of race.
Pego wrote:BTW, did you use to cycle competitively?
Yes, on the road and track.
Cool! And....to complete the puzzle...what's your taste in jazz?
Everything from Satchmo to Wynton, but I don't care too much for most electric jazz or avant-garde such as post-1965 Coltrane. I guess my favorite era was late 1950's thru mid 1960's. It's been great living in one of the major breeding grounds for jazz men and seeing scores of teenagers develop and grow up to become some of the most respected and in-demand musicians in the world.
By the way, it just occurred to me that Team Astana has four former Tour de France podium placers (top three) on it. Does anyone know if any other team has ever brought that much firepower to the Tour?
One thing that's certain is that Armstrong isn't the man he used to be. Before his retirement, he used to be able to take huge Herculean pulls of up to a minute or more towards the end of a team time trial when his teammates started to get tired. Today he seemed mortal, and instead in was Fabian Cancellera who looked like Superman by putting his team on his back in the last ten kilometers of the race, so I don't mind seeing him retain yellow over Armstrong.
Pego wrote:BTW, did you use to cycle competitively?
Yes, on the road and track.
Cool! And....to complete the puzzle...what's your taste in jazz?
Everything from Satchmo to Wynton, but I don't care too much for most electric jazz or avant-garde such as post-1965 Coltrane. I guess my favorite era was late 1950's thru mid 1960's. It's been great living in one of the major breeding grounds for jazz men and seeing scores of teenagers develop and grow up to become some of the most respected and in-demand musicians in the world.
By the way, it just occurred to me that Team Astana has four former Tour de France podium placers (top three) on it. Does anyone know if any other team has ever brought that much firepower to the Tour?
I think the La Vie Claire team of about 1984-86 was that good - Bernard Hinault, Greg LeMond, and Andy Hampsten, and Jean-Francois Bernard, who was pretty good - they finished 1-2-4 in the tour in 1986, with also a 7th and 12th (Bernard).
I don't know how many of you folks on this board have seen the route and profile of the penultimate stage of the Tour, but it should insure that this year's race will have the most dramatic finish since 1989, unless Contador turns out to be the animal that many people think he is.
Also, team radios will be banned for stages 10 and 13. That should make things interesting, since no one in today's peleton is old enough to have ridden in the pre-radio days.
jazzcyclist wrote:I don't know how many of you folks on this board have seen the route and profile of the penultimate stage of the Tour, but it should insure that this year's race will have the most dramatic finish since 1989, unless Contador turns out to be the animal that many people think he is.
I brought this up a few posts ago.
Friday they hit the mountains so we should get a pretty good idea of how Armstrong will end up.
502CD wrote:Friday they hit the mountains so we should get a pretty good idea of how Armstrong will end up.
I expect Contador to be in yellow tomorrow. I'm more concerned about Armstrong will do compared to Kloden and Leipheimer. If one of the other riders finishes close to Contador, I can see where Johann Bruyneel might decide to go with two protected riders and seven domestiques as an insurance policy. If I recall correctly, Contador and Leipheimer were both protected in 2007.
502CD wrote:Nocentini has yellow, Contador in second, and Lance in third. After tomorrow Contador will have the yellow for the rest of the Tour. Game, set, match.
I'll be interesting tomorrow as there's a Cat. 1 climb right in the beginning.
The only thing that we don't know for sure is how much firepower the other Astana riders had left in their legs, since there was no way they were going to chase down their own guy. But we can assume that the other GC contenders didn't have enough left in their tanks to go with Contador, otherwise, they would have. However, I'm guessing that you're right and that Armstrong, Kloden and Leipheimer rode at their limit to the finish line, but that is a just a guess. The other question is will Nocentini's team defend tomorrow, or will Astana have to ride on the front from the beginning?
jazzcyclist wrote:[ The other question is will Nocentini's team defend tomorrow, or will Astana have to ride on the front from the beginning?
With that early cat 1 climb the stage is ripe for somebody(s) taking off. When that happens my guess is it'll be Astana who does the chasing when they decide to start reeling him/they in.
Stage profiles suggest there won't be much GC action until the Alps and ITT. But it is already a really interesting tour so who knows. Some of the guys who got crushed in the TTT may make bids to get back on top.
As for today. I was surprised that Contador didn't look very smooth late in the climb. I don't recall him being as sloppy on the bike, especially at 6-7% grade. But he's the man to beat.
Bike racing is among the many topics on which I am a Dummy.
I do not understand all the talk of stages, attacks, etc. I presume team strategy is so they can take turns breaking the wind for each other or a designated winner but how is it different from X-C; first guy across the finish line ( or least elapsed time) wins.
How can you possibly call a winner hundreds of mile from the finish with a few seconds lead? If it is too complicated to explain here briefly, can someone please refer me to a bike racing primer.
lonewolf wrote:Bike racing is among the many topics on which I am a Dummy. I do not understand all the talk of stages, attacks, etc. I presume team strategy is so they can take turns breaking the wind for each other or a designated winner but how is it different from X-C; first guy across the finish line ( or least elapsed time) wins. How can you possibly call a winner hundreds of mile from the finish with a few seconds lead? If it is too complicated to explain here briefly, can someone please refer me to a bike racing primer.
In stage races like the Tour de France, the cyclist that rides the entire three-week race in the shortest amount of cumulative time wins; it's as simple as that. But the thing to remember is that drafting is a lot greater factor in cycling than it is in track and field. It allows the cycling equivalent of Usain Bolt to bike long distances at the same speeds as the cycling equivalent of Kenenisa Bekele, but only on the flats, where wind resistance is the biggest obstacle. Therefore, on the flat stages, you know before the race even starts that the weakest cyclist in the race will finish with the same time as the strongest cyclist in the race.
However, in the mountains, gravity is the biggest obstacle, and there is no significant drafting to speak of, thus the cream rises to the top. It's not uncommon for sprinters, who are usually among the heaviest cyclists in the peleton just like in track and field, to lose an hour or more on these stage.
For these reasons, strong riders like Lance Armstrong expend as little energy as possible on the flat road stages, since they know that there is no time to be gained. Instead, they prefer to expend their energy when it will gain them the most time, which is the mountain stages where gravity is the enemy and time trials where there is no drafting.
Thanks, jazz. It is reassuring to know that the least elapsed cycling time wins. Would be even better if he/she did it without collusion. What amazes me is, I have a good road bike and I have difficulty achieving unassisted on a flat course the speed these guys average over hundreds of miles.
Yes, thank you jc. That will make my early mornings, over the next little while, more enjoyable.
The TDF sure starts early, in Pacific Time. And you have to watch it live, right?